Sidebar Design Proposal

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
10 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Sidebar Design Proposal

Zhi Yu Yue
Hello everyone,

I ever posted in this mail list that IBM is further developing the sidebar concept. Sorry for being late. Here is the proposal that my colleague Ma Li put together, http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Sidebar_Proposal_by_IBM. Still a high level one, but I think it should be OK for some early discussion. To those people who have tried Symphony 1.3 sidebar, this one is very different and have big enhancement.

In the proposal above, we are using the sidebar not only for context sensitive formatting properties, but also for managing all the floating panels, such as style list, navigator, animation, template, gallery, and more. Users can change the properties in the sidebar easily and quickly -- all properties are applied at no time by just one click, better than property dialog. Users can also dock/undock the floating panels to the sidebar easily. In this way, these panels are becoming more visible and easy to manage -- In our previous survey, not all users are familiar with these panels, while the sidebar will help to improve the situation.

I saw a lot of discussion on the overall UI...these are all fantastic. Compared with Ribbon, sidebar/vertical UI is the way I preferred more. It leverages the working space better, much cleaner (instead of noisy), and still cooperate well with menu/toolbar.

Some design details are being refined. Any comments are welcome!
 
Best Regards,
Helen Yue

_________________________________________________________

Yue Zhi Yu  |
 Manager of User Experience & Applications, Lotus Symphony |  yuezhiyu@...
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Sidebar Design Proposal

Christoph Noack-4
Hi Helen Yue,

thank you so much for your proposal! I'm really happy that you and the
IBM team is more and more present here - that is a very good
development :-)

Am Montag, den 31.08.2009, 11:22 +0800 schrieb Zhi Yu Yue:
> Hello everyone,
>
> I ever posted in this mail list that IBM is further developing the
> sidebar concept. Sorry for being late. Here is the proposal that my
> colleague Ma Li put together,
> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Sidebar_Proposal_by_IBM.
> Still a high level one, but I think it should be OK for some early
> discussion. To those people who have tried Symphony 1.3 sidebar, this
> one is very different and have big enhancement.

I'm curious...

> In the proposal above, we are using the sidebar not only for context
> sensitive formatting properties, but also for managing all the
> floating panels, such as style list, navigator, animation, template,
> gallery, and more. Users can change the properties in the sidebar
> easily and quickly -- all properties are applied at no time by just
> one click, better than property dialog.

Just a few questions to better understand the proposal:
      * You talk about "applying at no time". Is there also some kind of
        "live preview" for the the formatting to be applied (e.g. when
        hovering with the mouse). As far as I can see there is no
        "preview", e.g. in the "style list".
      * Are the pictures of the proposal a mockup or is this already
        realized? I ask because of small minor inconsistencies
        (fragmented page text in the lower right, vertical scrollbar for
        the page thumbnails, the 71% in the toolbar vs. the 85% in the
        status bar). (... some time later ...) Ah, now I notice
        paragraph styles in the presentation module - these are mockups,
        right?
      * Did you reduce the overall number of options in the side panes?
        In the current Lotus Symphony there are "all properties" buttons
        and more visible per default (e.g. detailed underlining options
        in the word processor).

Since there has been no in-depth discussion about the general Lotus
Symphony UI, I would like to share some comments. What seems to be very
valuable is:
      * The explanation of groups in the right sidebar - also the little
        groups (e.g. alignment) is well presented
      * The "New" button in the upper left border (also I don't get the
        arrow...)
      * The overall "friendly" and (to me) pleasing visual
        representation

What I'm asking myself when looking on the proposal:
      * Do you have some experience how people cope with the different
        "handling" options of the sidebar elements itself. As far as I
        can see they can be: resized, docked/undocked,
        collapsed/expanded, closed, ... I'm a bit afraid of some users
        who accidentally "disorganize" the GUI. Visually, I don't know
        what happens when clicking on 'x' in the left sidebar. Is only
        the current tab closed, or will all tabs be closed at once?
      * A similar is about the tabs in the view. I can see three
        different tabs - do you know if all people know what they change
        (document, view, properties pages)?
      * By the way, are the tabs of the right sidepane positioned at the
        screen border when the window is maximized (easy selection)?
      * Is there a special reason for the proposed information
        architecture? All the manual formatting is provided within
        "Properties", where styles are presented in a different tab -
        but both tabs refer to e.g. "Paragraph formatting".
      * A similar question - you may just skip it if the design is work
        in progress :-) I notice that the navigator is placed in the
        right toolbar, whereas the rest of the sidepane (as far as I
        understand it) is used for formatting or inserting objects. The
        page thumbnails on the left side, do also provide navigation...
      * I already talked about the nice grouping of the elements in the
        sidepane (group names, ...). In contrast, the toolbar icons
        above seem to provide less grouping. It seems that - when
        thinking about OOo - both "default" toolbar and "formatting"
        toolbar are somehow integrated. Additionally, the icons seem to
        be very small and additonal "more" buttons have been added (at
        the left). Do you know whether these things are perceived by
        users?
      * The position of the "pop up panel" looks a bit "random" to me -
        the visualization is a drop down, but it opens in the middle of
        the slide.
 
I hope that is what you had in mind when asking for "comments". Just
tell me whether some of the might need further explanation...

> Users can also dock/undock the floating panels to the sidebar easily.
> In this way, these panels are becoming more visible and easy to manage
> -- In our previous survey, not all users are familiar with these
> panels, while the sidebar will help to improve the situation.

Could you please provide more details, since I don't understand
everything... The users had problems to understand the panels which are
docked per default? Undocking might make them more visible, but then
they had to be discovered, first? I'm confused :-)

> I saw a lot of discussion on the overall UI...these are all fantastic.
> Compared with Ribbon, sidebar/vertical UI is the way I preferred more.
> It leverages the working space better, much cleaner (instead of
> noisy), and still cooperate well with menu/toolbar.

> Some design details are being refined. Any comments are welcome!

Helen, thank you so much for sharing that. I hope we will get some more
valuable comments.

Best regards,
Christoph


---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Sidebar Design Proposal

Zhi Yu Yue
Hi Christoph,

Appreciated very much for sharing your excellent comments!

More background and answer to some questions as below. Ma Li is the designer for sidebar. I will leave other specific questions to him. Thanks.
1) Yes, it is design mockup, so as you noticed there are many details to work out. Some development is ongoing, but still some long way to go, and not all the design here is accepted in development scope.
2) This design proposed is mainly for two purposes. One is to manage all the UI panels by one vertical tab bar; the second is for the design for properties panel which is newly designed. You may find that the style list, navigator, and other panels are not changed much, because we haven't got that point. We ever developed several prototypes and did some study. The current vertical tab bar one in this design are most preferred.
3) Regarding the overall number of controls, you may notice that there is an ellipsis button in the upper right of each properties section. When users click the button, the all properties dialog will show up. We only put the most commonly used functions in sidebar. For example, users usually do not set "text rotation", so we do not keep this one in sidebar.
4) We do define different status for sidebar panels: docking, floating, closed, ... Users can drag any floating panels to the tab bar to dock it, or drag it out to be floating. Furthermore some panels are docked by default, and some are floating. Users can switch the panel by icons on the tab bar and by some commands. This part of design will be updated on wiki soon.
5) Thanks for your comments on the overall Symphony UI! We will keep going with the community...

One additional question, given that the overall UI discussion is so hot, do we have special UX activities in the coming OpenOffice.org conference? I'm still not sure if I can come, but it will be good opportunity to talk and share...

Best Regards,
Helen Yue

_________________________________________________________

Yue Zhi Yu  |
 Manager of User Experience & Applications, Lotus Symphony |  yuezhiyu@...
(8610)82452783 (phone) | 90-52783 (tie-line) | IBM China Development Laboratory



From:        Christoph Noack <[hidden email]>
To:        [hidden email]
Date:        09/01/2009 04:47 AM
Subject:        Re: [ux-user interface] Sidebar Design Proposal




Hi Helen Yue,

thank you so much for your proposal! I'm really happy that you and the
IBM team is more and more present here - that is a very good
development :-)

Am Montag, den 31.08.2009, 11:22 +0800 schrieb Zhi Yu Yue:
> Hello everyone,
>
> I ever posted in this mail list that IBM is further developing the
> sidebar concept. Sorry for being late. Here is the proposal that my
> colleague Ma Li put together,
>
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Sidebar_Proposal_by_IBM.
> Still a high level one, but I think it should be OK for some early
> discussion. To those people who have tried Symphony 1.3 sidebar, this
> one is very different and have big enhancement.

I'm curious...

> In the proposal above, we are using the sidebar not only for context
> sensitive formatting properties, but also for managing all the
> floating panels, such as style list, navigator, animation, template,
> gallery, and more. Users can change the properties in the sidebar
> easily and quickly -- all properties are applied at no time by just
> one click, better than property dialog.

Just a few questions to better understand the proposal:
     * You talk about "applying at no time". Is there also some kind of
       "live preview" for the the formatting to be applied (e.g. when
       hovering with the mouse). As far as I can see there is no
       "preview", e.g. in the "style list".
     * Are the pictures of the proposal a mockup or is this already
       realized? I ask because of small minor inconsistencies
       (fragmented page text in the lower right, vertical scrollbar for
       the page thumbnails, the 71% in the toolbar vs. the 85% in the
       status bar). (... some time later ...) Ah, now I notice
       paragraph styles in the presentation module - these are mockups,
       right?
     * Did you reduce the overall number of options in the side panes?
       In the current Lotus Symphony there are "all properties" buttons
       and more visible per default (e.g. detailed underlining options
       in the word processor).

Since there has been no in-depth discussion about the general Lotus
Symphony UI, I would like to share some comments. What seems to be very
valuable is:
     * The explanation of groups in the right sidebar - also the little
       groups (e.g. alignment) is well presented
     * The "New" button in the upper left border (also I don't get the
       arrow...)
     * The overall "friendly" and (to me) pleasing visual
       representation

What I'm asking myself when looking on the proposal:
     * Do you have some experience how people cope with the different
       "handling" options of the sidebar elements itself. As far as I
       can see they can be: resized, docked/undocked,
       collapsed/expanded, closed, ... I'm a bit afraid of some users
       who accidentally "disorganize" the GUI. Visually, I don't know
       what happens when clicking on 'x' in the left sidebar. Is only
       the current tab closed, or will all tabs be closed at once?
     * A similar is about the tabs in the view. I can see three
       different tabs - do you know if all people know what they change
       (document, view, properties pages)?
     * By the way, are the tabs of the right sidepane positioned at the
       screen border when the window is maximized (easy selection)?
     * Is there a special reason for the proposed information
       architecture? All the manual formatting is provided within
       "Properties", where styles are presented in a different tab -
       but both tabs refer to e.g. "Paragraph formatting".
     * A similar question - you may just skip it if the design is work
       in progress :-) I notice that the navigator is placed in the
       right toolbar, whereas the rest of the sidepane (as far as I
       understand it) is used for formatting or inserting objects. The
       page thumbnails on the left side, do also provide navigation...
     * I already talked about the nice grouping of the elements in the
       sidepane (group names, ...). In contrast, the toolbar icons
       above seem to provide less grouping. It seems that - when
       thinking about OOo - both "default" toolbar and "formatting"
       toolbar are somehow integrated. Additionally, the icons seem to
       be very small and additonal "more" buttons have been added (at
       the left). Do you know whether these things are perceived by
       users?
     * The position of the "pop up panel" looks a bit "random" to me -
       the visualization is a drop down, but it opens in the middle of
       the slide.

I hope that is what you had in mind when asking for "comments". Just
tell me whether some of the might need further explanation...

> Users can also dock/undock the floating panels to the sidebar easily.
> In this way, these panels are becoming more visible and easy to manage
> -- In our previous survey, not all users are familiar with these
> panels, while the sidebar will help to improve the situation.

Could you please provide more details, since I don't understand
everything... The users had problems to understand the panels which are
docked per default? Undocking might make them more visible, but then
they had to be discovered, first? I'm confused :-)

> I saw a lot of discussion on the overall UI...these are all fantastic.
> Compared with Ribbon, sidebar/vertical UI is the way I preferred more.
> It leverages the working space better, much cleaner (instead of
> noisy), and still cooperate well with menu/toolbar.

> Some design details are being refined. Any comments are welcome!

Helen, thank you so much for sharing that. I hope we will get some more
valuable comments.

Best regards,
Christoph


---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]


Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Sidebar Design Proposal

Christoph Noack-4
Hi Helen Yue,

thank you for you kind and fast reply. At the same time I'm very sorry
that I'm currently packing my stuff for my vacation, so there is only
few time for some comments.

Am Dienstag, den 01.09.2009, 17:19 +0800 schrieb Zhi Yu Yue:

> Hi Christoph,
>
> Appreciated very much for sharing your excellent comments!
>
> More background and answer to some questions as below. Ma Li is the
> designer for sidebar. I will leave other specific questions to him.
> Thanks.
> 1) Yes, it is design mockup, so as you noticed there are many details
> to work out. Some development is ongoing, but still some long way to
> go, and not all the design here is accepted in development scope.

Okay, I understand.

> 2) This design proposed is mainly for two purposes. One is to manage
> all the UI panels by one vertical tab bar; the second is for the
> design for properties panel which is newly designed. You may find that
> the style list, navigator, and other panels are not changed much,
> because we haven't got that point. We ever developed several
> prototypes and did some study. The current vertical tab bar one in
> this design are most preferred.

I appreciate your kind of development process. May I ask you what kind
of users you test with?

> 3) Regarding the overall number of controls, you may notice that there
> is an ellipsis button in the upper right of each properties section.
> When users click the button, the all properties dialog will show up.
> We only put the most commonly used functions in sidebar. For example,
> users usually do not set "text rotation", so we do not keep this one
> in sidebar.

Mmh, I'm asking myself whether an implementation right into the sidebar
would make sense. Why? The button/icon itself is really small and might
be mixed up with "close" - instead of closing the sidebar a new window
pops up. Especially I think of people with slightly reduced visual
abilities.

Instead of opening a separate window, the content could be displayed
right there. Think of adding a complete horizontal bar in the sidepane -
this would provide a large click area which could be expanded/collapsed
and it may better consider contextual behavior. But maybe you already
thought about that...

Nevertheless, since I'm still very happy when thinking about the results
of the designs provided by the community some months ago: In the Design
Proposal Collection who provided solutions for handling such a lot of
content. One example:
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Proposal_by_Andreas_Schuderer

And a live mockup:
http://schuderer.net/ooo_impress_scrolling


> 4) We do define different status for sidebar panels: docking,
> floating, closed, ... Users can drag any floating panels to the tab
> bar to dock it, or drag it out to be floating. Furthermore some panels
> are docked by default, and some are floating. Users can switch the
> panel by icons on the tab bar and by some commands. This part of
> design will be updated on wiki soon.

Although it provides great flexibility, I'm just unsure whether
"ordinary" users will be able to handle that. Maybe my concerns are
superfluous :-)

> 5) Thanks for your comments on the overall Symphony UI! We will keep
> going with the community...

That is good to hear - since we have a very similar goal. By the way,
did you (or your team) had the time to look on our research results? Is
there something which can be shared among you and OpenOffice.org
project?

> One additional question, given that the overall UI discussion is so
> hot, do we have special UX activities in the coming OpenOffice.org
> conference? I'm still not sure if I can come, but it will be good
> opportunity to talk and share...
>
If not for the reason of the OOoCon, you should try to visit Italy :-)
Last year I have been at the CHI in Florence - a great time.

Back to your question. Jaron, Liz, Andreas, Frank (...) discussed some
proposals which have been uploaded to the OOoCon conference server. Now
we are looking forward whether some of them get accepted. I would like
to wait until I can say more ...

Is your team planning to give do presentations or workshops like last
year? I really hope that you will be able to come...

> Best Regards,
> Helen Yue

Thank you Helen! Have a nice day,
Christoph

[...]


---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [ux-discuss] Sidebar Design Proposal

Cor Nouws
In reply to this post by Zhi Yu Yue
Hi Helen, *,

Zhi Yu Yue wrote (31-8-2009 5:22)

> I ever posted in this mail list that IBM is further developing the
> sidebar concept. Sorry for being late. Here is the proposal that my
> colleague Ma Li put together,
> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Sidebar_Proposal_by_IBM. Still
> a high level one, but I think it should be OK for some early discussion.
> To those people who have tried Symphony 1.3 sidebar, this one is very
> different and have big enhancement.

Thanks for this proposal. I do remember the promise, and I do like the
proposal.
And also thanks to Christoph for his detailed questions - more than I
could have thought of ;-)
I have two questions myself.

> [...]but also for managing all the floating
> panels, such as style list, navigator, animation, template, gallery, and
> more.

What happens when the width of a panel is changed? Do the controls hide
partly, or do they get rearranged?
(Sorry, maybe I should have checked Symphony 1.35)

> Users can change the properties in the sidebar easily and quickly
> -- all properties are applied at no time by just one click, better than
> property dialog. [...]

How will this work with styles? Will the properties of style x be
available in a sort of side pane, and are changes visible directly, just
as with directly applied formatting?

Thanks for your further explanation,

Kindest regards,
Cor

--
Cor Nouws
   - nl.OpenOffice.org marketing contact
   - Community Contributor Representative in the Community Council
Gevoel niet vrij te zijn? Zie www.nieuwsteversie.nl

---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [ux-discuss] Sidebar Design Proposal

Li CDL Ma

Hi Cor,

Thanks for the questions. I would like to reply the questions for Helen.
Please have a look below.

Cor Nouws <[hidden email]> wrote on 2009-09-02 14:16:41:

> From:
>
> Cor Nouws <[hidden email]>
>
> To:
>
> [hidden email].
>
> Cc:
>
> [hidden email], Li CDL Ma/China/IBM@IBMCN:
>
> Date:.
>
> 2009-09-02 14:17.
>
> Subject:
>
> Re: [ux-discuss] Sidebar Design Proposal
>
> Hi Helen, *,
>
> Zhi Yu Yue wrote (31-8-2009 5:22)
>
> > I ever posted in this mail list that IBM is further developing the
> > sidebar concept. Sorry for being late. Here is the proposal that my
> > colleague Ma Li put together,
> > http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Sidebar_Proposal_by_IBM. Still

> > a high level one, but I think it should be OK for some early
discussion.

> > To those people who have tried Symphony 1.3 sidebar, this one is very
> > different and have big enhancement.
>
> Thanks for this proposal. I do remember the promise, and I do like the
> proposal.
> And also thanks to Christoph for his detailed questions - more than I
> could have thought of ;-)
> I have two questions myself.
>
> > [...]but also for managing all the floating
> > panels, such as style list, navigator, animation, template, gallery,
and
> > more.
>
> What happens when the width of a panel is changed? Do the controls hide
> partly, or do they get rearranged?
> (Sorry, maybe I should have checked Symphony 1.35)

As an ideal solution, the controls should be rearranged following the
changes of widths. But consider the DEV effort limiation, in recent
Symphony version(2.0), we have to make the controls fixed. That means: a
scroll bar will be shown if the width is not enough to show the controls.

>
> > Users can change the properties in the sidebar easily and quickly
> > -- all properties are applied at no time by just one click, better than

> > property dialog. [...]
>
> How will this work with styles? Will the properties of style x be
> available in a sort of side pane, and are changes visible directly, just
> as with directly applied formatting?

Yes. You hit the point. As ideal solution, we should integrate the styles
to the properties sidebar, then users can change the style visible.
We have run some user study, and find that users are eager to have the
styles in sidebar. But for current DEV effort limitation, we cannot have it
now. We expect to include it to sidebar ASAP.
Sorry I just paste the mockup which are discounted by develop team.

>
> Thanks for your further explanation,
>
> Kindest regards,
> Cor
>
> --
> Cor Nouws
>    - nl.OpenOffice.org marketing contact
>    - Community Contributor Representative in the Community Council
> Gevoel niet vrij te zijn? Zie www.nieuwsteversie.nl
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [ux-discuss] Sidebar Design Proposal

Li CDL Ma
In reply to this post by Zhi Yu Yue

Thanks for the comments, Irné.

There are many applications which take such sidebar patterns. For example,
Adobe Flash CS4. And also the All-in-One Sidebar add-on for Firefox. They
are good trials for the patterns.

About the issue you mentioned on AiOS, I think it is a good point. The
content area will be expanded/shrinked when the sidebar is open/closed,
especially when we make users can hide the sidebar automatically.

We have consider this in the past. It is hard to solve the problems on Word
Processor and Presentation editor. But for Spreadsheet editor, we don't
have this problem, because the spreadsheet often start from a side and
expand long and long to another side. So the sidebar may can hide/show
automatically in that case.

About the second point you have shown, to show more than one panels at one
time on sidebar, I think so. I think it is good for us to make the panels
can be organized freely on the sidebar, and even, when they are float. Then
users can show the two/three or more panels at one time on sidebar, and
still can switch between the panels via tab.

But about Style List, I think an appropriate way to deal with it is
integrate it to the Properties Sidebar we proposed. Properties Sidebar is
an important concept in the proposal. It is context sensitive. Users can
find most of properties/settings there when they have the needs to find
them. Then we can avoid to make users open more and more panels at most
time. At certain context, they just need limited properties/settings. We
just give them the handy ones.

What's your opinion? Thanks :)


Have a nice day.


Irné Barnard <[hidden email]> wrote on 2009-09-02 22:45:29:

> From:
>
> Irné Barnard <[hidden email]>
>
> To:
>
> [hidden email]
>
> Cc:
>
> [hidden email], Li CDL Ma/China/IBM@IBMCN
>
> Date:.
>
> 2009-09-02 22:46.
>
> Subject:
>
> Re: [ux-discuss] Sidebar Design Proposal
>
> That looks reminiscent of the All-in-One Sidebar (AiOS) add-on for
Firefox (
> http://firefox.exxile.net/aios/index.php) ;-) . It's basically a
> tabbed toolbar derivative with the tabs on the side (I assume like
> with prototype 0.16 the tabs should be below on the "ribbon", but
> also to the left of the right-hand sidebar - but that's not
> important at present).
>
> Could I suggest extending the sidebar beyond what AiOS is at
> present? There's an issue with AiOS which they've got on their ToDo list
(

> http://firefox.exxile.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7659 & http://
> firefox.exxile.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8597). This IMHO causes
> problems when the user hides / displays the toolbar (especially if
> like AiOS you do this automatically on mouse-over) - the workspace
> shrinks and adjusts / moves the page.
>
> And then ... I've suggested this before ... could scrolling-
> collapsible panels be used inside the sidebar / "ribbon" - tabbed-
> toolbar? This so the user could have 2 (or more) panels open at
> once, have a scrollbar if needed. E.g. opening the Stylist &
> Properties at once would happen quite often ... I think :-D . I
> suggest showing which are currently displayed by highlighting their tabs.


> Regards Irné Barnard
>
>
> Zhi Yu Yue wrote:
> Hello everyone,
>
> I ever posted in this mail list that IBM is further developing the
> sidebar concept. Sorry for being late. Here is the proposal that my
> colleague Ma Li put together, http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/
> wiki/Sidebar_Proposal_by_IBM. Still a high level one, but I think it
> should be OK for some early discussion. To those people who have
> tried Symphony 1.3 sidebar, this one is very different and have big
> enhancement.
>
> In the proposal above, we are using the sidebar not only for context
> sensitive formatting properties, but also for managing all the
> floating panels, such as style list, navigator, animation, template,
> gallery, and more. Users can change the properties in the sidebar
> easily and quickly -- all properties are applied at no time by just
> one click, better than property dialog. Users can also dock/undock
> the floating panels to the sidebar easily. In this way, these panels
> are becoming more visible and easy to manage -- In our previous
> survey, not all users are familiar with these panels, while the
> sidebar will help to improve the situation.
>
> I saw a lot of discussion on the overall UI...these are all
> fantastic. Compared with Ribbon, sidebar/vertical UI is the way I
> preferred more. It leverages the working space better, much cleaner
> (instead of noisy), and still cooperate well with menu/toolbar.
>
> Some design details are being refined. Any comments are welcome!
>
> Best Regards,
> Helen Yue
> _________________________________________________________
> Yue Zhi Yu  |  Manager of User Experience & Applications, Lotus
> Symphony | [image removed]  [hidden email]
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Re: [ux-discuss] Sidebar Design Proposal

Cor Nouws
In reply to this post by Li CDL Ma
Hi Li,

Li CDL Ma wrote (7-9-2009 14:23)

> Cor Nouws <[hidden email]> wrote on 2009-09-02 14:16:41:
>> Zhi Yu Yue wrote (31-8-2009 5:22)
>>
>>> [...]but also for managing all the floating
>>> panels, such as style list, navigator, animation, template, gallery,
>>> and more.
>>
>> What happens when the width of a panel is changed? Do the controls hide
>> partly, or do they get rearranged?
>> (Sorry, maybe I should have checked Symphony 1.35)
>
> As an ideal solution, the controls should be rearranged following the
> changes of widths. But consider the DEV effort limiation, in recent
> Symphony version(2.0), we have to make the controls fixed. That means: a
> scroll bar will be shown if the width is not enough to show the controls.

OK, not ideal, but we can live with that (in this close to ideal ;-) world )

>>> Users can change the properties in the sidebar easily and quickly
>>> -- all properties are applied at no time by just one click, better than
>>> property dialog. [...]
>>
>> How will this work with styles? Will the properties of style x be
>> available in a sort of side pane, and are changes visible directly, just
>> as with directly applied formatting?
>
> Yes. You hit the point. As ideal solution, we should integrate the styles
> to the properties sidebar, then users can change the style visible.
> We have run some user study, and find that users are eager to have the
> styles in sidebar. But for current DEV effort limitation, we cannot have it
> now. We expect to include it to sidebar ASAP.
> Sorry I just paste the mockup which are discounted by develop team.

Thanks for your honest answer. Good to read what the wish from users and
  your team is like. Only sad it cannot be integrated yet.

<dreaming>
   maybe some joint effort could help
<continue dreaming>

Best regards,

Cor


--
Cor Nouws
   - nl.OpenOffice.org marketing contact
   - Community Contributor Representative in the Community Council
Gevoel niet vrij te zijn? Zie www.nieuwsteversie.nl

---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Lotus Symphony UI

Andreas Bartel
In reply to this post by Li CDL Ma
Hi Helen,

I've been using Lotus Symphony 1.3 lately, just to check out your UI
concepts and how they work. I have a few questions I'd really like to
ask you.

1. How was/is your design strategy regarding the side panes? How do you
decide what goes in and what not (e.g. Some text formatting elements are
in the toolbars and some or similar are in the side pane)?
2. Why is the wording in the menus so different to OpenOffice.org or
other office applications (e.g. Create vs. Insert)? Did you change that
to have more familiarity with older Lotus applications for those users
who know e.g. Lotus 123?
3. The way how to insert shapes is very different (Menu: Create>Drawing
Objects ...> then the toolbar appears). How did you decide to go into
that direction?
4. You still have a few toolbars that behave simiarly to OpenOffice.org
UI. Is there some sort of a design concept how the toolbars, the menu
and the side pane interact between eachother. Are they complemetary,
exclusive and anything like that?

Many thanks for the info!

Best regards,
Andreas

---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Lotus Symphony UI

Zhi Yu Yue
Hi Andreas,

Sorry for my late response. All these are great questions. I add my
thoughts below, but please note that they are just my personal take.

BTW, are you doing a study of Lotus Symphony UI? If yes, we will be very
glad to have your input...

Best Regards,
Helen Yue

[hidden email] wrote on 09/10/2009 10:19:20 PM:

> From: Andreas Bartel <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Cc: Li CDL Ma/China/IBM@IBMCN
> Date: 09/10/2009 10:12 PM
> Subject: [ux-user interface] Lotus Symphony UI
> Sent by: [hidden email]
>
> Hi Helen,
>
> I've been using Lotus Symphony 1.3 lately, just to check out your UI
> concepts and how they work. I have a few questions I'd really like to
> ask you.
>
> 1. How was/is your design strategy regarding the side panes? How do you
> decide what goes in and what not (e.g. Some text formatting elements are

> in the toolbars and some or similar are in the side pane)?

Toolbar and sidebar have totally different proposition. Property sidebar
is for properties and it is context sensitive; while toolbar is for
commands and only for most frequently used commands. We have very strict
limits on what to put on toolbar.

People spend a lot of time to deal with kinds of properties in document
editing. That's why we design property sidebar -- for users to find and
set the properties easily and quickly. In the proposal I submitted to the
community,  
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Sidebar_Proposal_by_IBM, we
further developed the sidebar concept to managing all the floating panels,
such as style list, navigator and so on. I do think it is one big step
forward to expose these panels and make the panel management easily and
consistently.

I know there are a few properties covered both by toolbar and sidebar, but
that is not a big problem. We leave a few properties in the toolbar to
respect users' habit -- users are used to find font size/b/i/u there. It's
users' knowledge accumulated in the past, but in general properties are on
the sidebar.

> 2. Why is the wording in the menus so different to OpenOffice.org or
> other office applications (e.g. Create vs. Insert)? Did you change that
> to have more familiarity with older Lotus applications for those users
> who know e.g. Lotus 123?

I do not think the wording is so different...most of the terms are same.
Create vs. Insert is a special example. You made a good guess. We are
aligning Lotus Symphony's wording with other applications, and also Lotus
application. It's why we use "Create" instead of "Insert".

> 3. The way how to insert shapes is very different (Menu: Create>Drawing
> Objects ...> then the toolbar appears). How did you decide to go into
> that direction?
I think it is an issue instead of direction. It needs to be improved in
the future.

> 4. You still have a few toolbars that behave simiarly to OpenOffice.org
> UI. Is there some sort of a design concept how the toolbars, the menu
> and the side pane interact between eachother. Are they complemetary,
> exclusive and anything like that?
Definitely we have some general guidelines on main menu, toolbar, and
sidebar. I have explained the relationship of toolbar and sidebar. About
main menu, one general rule is that main menu should provide the access of
all functions. It's a common guideline in industry. I'm also curious that
OOo took a different way here, since some features can only be accessed by
toolbar or context menu. I suggest we improve it some time.

>
> Many thanks for the info!
>
Thanks for using Lotus Symphony!

> Best regards,
> Andreas
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>